2004-09-10 [spyco_lover]: oh not this again lol... i'm not a part of this wiki (as anybody that has been to my house can tell) but i mean from when i started commenting here that has come up so much

2004-09-10 [HiddenFire]: I've been waiting for someone to say somthing like that. *sighs* I am pro gay marriage but they have their rights. Honestly I wish there where more places devoted to open, honest, civilized, and intelligent debate. But it seems as if asking for all of those things from a human is just asking too much. *shrugs* In any case, we have all developed hard shells on the issue and I think I speak for people on both sides of the debate when I say that we are all firmly resolute in our convictions. We are not quick to change our minds. Thusly, the debate serves no real purpose but to incite emotional attacks and perhaps sway a few who have yet to choose a side. *sighs* @.@

2004-09-10 [spyco_lover]: exactly, and even when people do argue about that, they just repeat the same things, i tend to debate both sides just because i can see why people have each opinion

2004-09-10 [Snowboarding Hobitz]: i tend to say out of debaits...i'm very vocal and i tend to say things that aren't to nice...so, changing the subject...i put out a fire today with the firefighters ^__^ GO ME

2004-09-10 [spyco_lover]: awesome lol i tend to start fires more than put them out

2004-09-10 [HellzHalo426]: morning sunshine!

2004-09-10 [dark cleric]: ...I wish not to sound like an antagonistic ass, but I do belive that all people were created equal no matter their denomonation nor their sexual prefrence, so I find it offensive that you do not agree with Homosexual, nor Lesbian marriges, you are nothing but a Homophobe, some of my best friends are gay, I'm striaght 100% and I do not care I think people like you do not deserve to be open to opinion but...as an american Citizen we are all open to it so once again I appologize I just had to say that

2004-09-10 [HellzHalo426]: uhm..yeah...everyone has good points as usual...yes i am bi but as this goes alot of people who are gay or bi come to this site and sit here and talk about how this page is stupid and you shouldnt harass people with this site but they dont know that by coming here and saying all this stuff that they are harassing us...

2004-09-10 [HellzHalo426]: ohh lookie a wiki! i made a wiki! will you join? brittany lovers

2004-09-10 [Snowboarding Hobitz]: well...thats a nice opinion you got there....*applauds*...

2004-09-11 [Lioness123]: ugh...for a second I thought that was a Brittany spears fan club!! *puts away pipe bomb*

2004-09-11 [Mystin]: I just love reading all the names of people I'm not going to talk to cause they're close minded f'ks.

2004-09-11 [Snowboarding Hobitz]: good for you...now we don't have to listin to you

2004-09-11 [Lioness123]: *mumbles something under breath*

2004-09-11 [Pale-Suzie]: hehe, now ppl don't get all worked up. :P oh and mysterium, you almost sounded okay until you called them fucks, if you took the time to talk to them you would discover that at least some of them are real nice *waves to indian* y'know, just because they have different views doesn't mean they're like non human or something.. :P

2004-09-11 [HellzHalo426]: morning! and no tis not brittany spears...*burst out laughing* whod join a fanclub for her newayz?! *no offense to anyone that will*

2004-09-11 [Pale-Suzie]: hehe, i sure wouldn't... tons of zombie britney fans walking around haunting us all with ehr music... *shivers* sry, not much of a britney fan. :P lol. oh and god morning to you... ^_^

2004-09-11 [VoLcOmBabE9125]: i wanna join!

2004-09-11 [Snowboarding Hobitz]: leave a message to [dfafadsfasdasf] asking him to add you...you can pretty much start chatting now if you want

2004-09-11 [H.R. PuffNStuff]: okay dont judge people like us either for our sexual preference! if you dont like to see it then dont look! screw what the "bible" says LOVE IS LOVE!!! thats it!

2004-09-11 [Pale-Suzie]: thanks for supporting gay marriage, i do to and can relate... but what is it with ppl who come in here and just write one single message? plz some debate here ppl...

2004-09-11 [Snowboarding Hobitz]: once again...you have a very interesting opinion, and i can respect that..but please respect our beliefs as well, most people here hold the bible in high respect and would appriciate it if you could write messages to the adult level

2004-09-11 [Taran DarkSide]: Bible is a joke. Did you know that the bible doesn't say that being gay is wrong? it's not in the top 10 sins. Hell, it didn't make it into the top 100 sins...

2004-09-11 [Snowboarding Hobitz]: right...and your a scholor right? you read the bible front to back and analized all aspects of it...i'm not going to argue this with you, bash me if you wish..just please respect my beliefs even if you don't agree with them, i have never said anything hurtful to a gay/lesbian/bi person, nor have i ever told them they are wrong...jsut do me the same favor, okay

2004-09-11 [H.R. PuffNStuff]: i think my message about my opinion is at an adult level, yeah i use to date someone who held the bible in a very high respect, i do as well on some topics this just happens to be one that i dont. I dont believe you are going to hell if you love someone of the same sex, i also dont think it is wrong, yeah you people have your opinions but i also think some of you are hypocrites

2004-09-11 [Snowboarding Hobitz]: when did we ever say homosexual people are going to hell? and comments like "skrew the bible" most people would consider quite childish. I'll say again, i'm not going to argue this, were just going to upset each other. But as I said, just please be respectful twoards us and our beliefs, I'm sorry you've met people who gave you that impression of heterosexual/religious persons, but, they aren't everyone

2004-09-11 [Mikhul, the Bard]: Whatever your opinion is, there is no right, and no wrong. if u are pro-gay u are considered as free spirited, open, new-era...if u are against homosexuality, u are "close-minded"..."too-christian" etc...although I am bisexual, and I support Gay marriage, I think its wrong to say that someone is "close-minded" or a "bad person" just because they have been taught/believe/raised to believe that homosexuality is wrong, etc. Its part of who they are, and it does not make them a bad person....its been clearly stated that members of this wiki cannot treat homosexual people badly, and I believe that they do not. But they are free to believe what they want to believe. I am not going to talk bad ....

2004-09-11 [Mikhul, the Bard]: ...about any members of this wiki, or the fact that some of them may be christian. I am not going to degrade the bible either. Although I am wiccan, I respect other people's religions and beliefs, and I keep all negative comments to myself. Do I support gay marriage? YES! but am I going to insult anyone on this page, calling them biggots or something, just because they dont support what I want to support? NO! I dont know about you all, but the world would be one boring ball if everybody agreed with with everybody. We are supposed to have christians, muslims, wiccans, jews, straights, gays, bisexuals, etc....we can't all be the same. I am not going to support...

2004-09-11 [Tiger Shark]: I'm Christian, and I don't appriciate when Cristianity and the Bible are blamed for Anti-Gay opinions. Sure, I'm against it, but my faith isn't the only factor. In fact, it wasn't a factor at all.

2004-09-11 [Mikhul, the Bard]: ...this wiki, because of my own pro-gay beliefs, but I am not going to bash it. Never. As long as the members on this wiki do not physically try to harm anyone or defamate their name based solely on sexual orientation. Good day to all!

2004-09-11 [Tiger Shark]: that's in our rules

2004-09-11 [HiddenFire]: My only issue with those that are against gay marriage is that when I look at the topic I can see clearly that gay marriage is ok. And I can argue that against ANYONE but no one listens. People who are against gay marraige simply CANNOT support their claims. They can use the bible, but it's really not a religious issue, it's a government issue. *shrugs* I may be more intelligent than 98% of the population of the world but I simply cannot understand how anyone can be against gay marrige unless it is out of pure ignorance. *shrugs* No offense, I simply do not understand.

2004-09-11 [Tiger Shark]: I personally don't know why people are for it. And yes, we can support our claims.

2004-09-11 [HiddenFire]: So it seems as if it all boils down to opinions. And neither side will ever be able to see over the wall that both have built. @.@

2004-09-11 [HiddenFire]: Homosexuals want the right to be married because there are gay couples that are just as commited to each other as married straight couples. They want the same rights and priveliges that are afforded straight married couples. It's only fair. http://www.religioustolerance.org/mar_bene.htm

2004-09-11 [Tiger Shark]: that's how politics work

2004-09-11 [HiddenFire]: It's not so much politics as it is human nature. We are a proud species, we rarely admit when we are wrong. it doesn't matter if gay marriage is right or wrong, the people who have chosen sides simply cannot change sides because of their pride. They have gotten in line for the roller coaster, and although they might be afraid to ride it, they are more afriad to seem the coward by passing all the people behind them on the way out. Human nature.

2004-09-11 [The Scarlet Pumpernickle]: I don't support gay marraige but I don't bash every body who does...I doubt that the issue will ever be resolved the way everyone wants it to..some people say ministers should Have to perform marraiges for homosexuals and if that happened religious freedom wouldn't exist

2004-09-11 [HiddenFire]: whoever those "some people" are, they are idiots! You simply cannot force anyone to marry you (join two people in marriage). To demand to get married by a minister is silly, especially if the minister says no! Get married by someone who has been granted the power by the state!

2004-09-11 [HiddenFire]: Though there are churches and ministers who will marry people (join two people in marriage). They could at least settle for them. Religious freedom is not really going to suffer at all. Or at least it shouldn't. Some of this crap that I've been hearing is just silly. No I'm not talking about what you're saying. Things where people are offended by something so they get it removed. Such as all the things with getting prayer out of the schools and the 10 commandments out of the courtyard of that one law office. It's all silly. But I support it to a degree. The state should not appear to support any particular religion, it's simply an abbuse of power.

2004-09-11 [The Scarlet Pumpernickle]: Exactly. If gay marraige is leagelized then we people who are against it will have to deal with it...but forcing people to marry someone in a way which they consider wrong will just make the rift between supporters and none supporters grow

2004-09-11 [The Scarlet Pumpernickle]: acctually in france it is illeagle to wear a religious symbal to school or pray in school

2004-09-11 [HiddenFire]: Indeed. The people against it will simply have to deal with it. In time the gap will close and people will look back and wonder why it was ever an issue. But if we force people to do things that are against their will then it will only make things worse. In any case, we are on the edge of a sexual revolution. I am almost certain that sometime soon there are going to be some major changes in how the average person views sexuality. Hopefully people will still keep disease in mind or we're in for some serious trouble. @.@

2004-09-11 [HiddenFire]: well, that's just silly! I would do it anyway. And if someone was offended by it then I would tell them that their offense is their problem. Offended does a good job of explaining my opinion on that issue.

2004-09-11 [HiddenFire]: I am also against affirmative action. To force employers to meet a quota of the amount of "minorities" they hire is just plain rediculous. It's not helping anything. It's making the racism issue much worse.

2004-09-11 [The Scarlet Pumpernickle]: I know...

2004-09-11 [Snowboarding Hobitz]: finnlay...a debait, not just hurtful commments

2004-09-12 [HiddenFire]: debate? where? @.@

2004-09-12 [Pale-Suzie]: hehe, more like hiddenfires own personal ramble... sry, just teasing you. :P but i agree, telling ppl that they HAVE to hire minoritis just makes the racism that much more obvious... ppl should be hired based on their talent... not their race or sexual orietation( but of course that is to much to ask for -_-) oh and for the whole thing with the gap dissepering... well, back in the 80s i think it was when gay marriage became legal in dk (first country, makes me proud. :P) i bet there was a lot of protesting... but today, well, i think there's a lot of ppl who don't even know it's legal, cause it's just become a part of everyday life... and the ones who do think about it...

2004-09-12 [Pale-Suzie]: well i haven't really heard any complaints lately... that's all it took, some 20 years, and now, all the (sry) fanatics who were against it, don't even care anylonger...

2004-09-12 [Lioness123]: no offense hiddenfire, but from what I've read here, you seem pretty cocky to me...

2004-09-12 [Deirdre O'Kelly]: Psh... ridiculous wiki...

2004-09-12 [HiddenFire]: In reguard to Lioness123: Just because I said I was more intelligent than 98% of the population of the world? Or because I am heavily opinionated, back it up with sound logic, and you see no other way to attack me? *shrugs* of course that was just a little jab. ~_^ and yes, this was more like my own personal rant, LOL. I have a tendancy to do that. @.@

2004-09-12 [Tiger Shark]: and why is this wiki rediculous?!? we are intitled to our opinions as much as anyone. we have our rights too

2004-09-12 [HiddenFire]: with the same argument, we also are left with the fact that deirdre is allowed to think this wiki rediculous, she's intitled to her opinion as well. LOL ~_^ Sorry, I couldn't help but notice the irony in that statement. ^_^

2004-09-12 [Tiger Shark]: .......<.<....>.>.......well, somehow the world these days is full of irony

2004-09-12 [HiddenFire]: Indeed! Just the other day a little girl told my sister "I'm not talking to you." LOL ^_^ irony amuses me greatly. ^_^

2004-09-12 [Tiger Shark]: lol, irony is funny, but somehow extremely annoying O.o.

2004-09-12 [Pale-Suzie]: no no no! irony is gooooooood! my mom's got this trip at the moment with giving us this little 'guilty bear' something everytime we say something ironic (my sister and i) and it has become a permanent part of my room... ah, irnoy, who can live without it? ^_^

2004-09-12 [Tiger Shark]: fun fun ^-^

2004-09-12 [Pale-Suzie]: hehe, i think so to. ^_^

2004-09-12 [Tiger Shark]: ^-^

2004-09-12 [Pale-Suzie]: no no, who has their mouth up between their eyes. that's not possible! *tries.... fails* nope, still down there... :P

2004-09-12 [Tiger Shark]: it's a kitty. that's it's nose. ^-^

2004-09-12 [Pale-Suzie]: uuuh, nice little kitty... :P

2004-09-12 [Tiger Shark]: ~^-^~ with wiskers

2004-09-12 [Pale-Suzie]: hehe, little kitty with wiskers lol... personally i'm more of a dog person. :P

2004-09-12 [Tiger Shark]: I like 'em both

2004-09-12 [Pale-Suzie]: heh, i dunno why, i just never cared much for cats... they're cute but... yeah.

2004-09-12 [Tiger Shark]: they can be like dogs some times

2004-09-12 [Pale-Suzie]: yeah i know... but then again i don't think i'm much of the pet person at all... heh, just don't have the time to take care of one... i'd be afraid i would neglect it... so i don't even think i would ever dare to get one... cat nor dog...

2004-09-12 [Tiger Shark]: same here

2004-09-12 [Snowboarding Hobitz]: woah!!! wha'd i miss

2004-09-12 [Pale-Suzie]: uhm, not much i think. :P

2004-09-12 [Snowboarding Hobitz]: oh....okay than

2004-09-12 [Pale-Suzie]: heh, you sound dissapointed, aren't you happy you didn't really miss anything? :P¨

2004-09-12 [Snowboarding Hobitz]: i'm just saying okay...not dissapointed, just to lazy to go back and read all the commments

2004-09-12 [rocker reject]: someone talk to me plz>>> :(

2004-09-13 [Tiger Shark]: *talks to you*

2004-09-13 [Snowboarding Hobitz]: hi....

2004-09-13 [Tiger Shark]: hi

2004-09-13 [Snowboarding Hobitz]: hey...ya know what bothers me...people who love to wallow in self pity "i wanna die, everyone hates me....but i don't want to talk about it" *slaps ppl GET A LIFE

2004-09-13 [Tiger Shark]: *nods*

2004-09-13 [Snowboarding Hobitz]: UGh.....i'm sorry, its one of my peeves

2004-09-13 [Leelo]: huh???

2004-09-13 [Pale-Suzie]: heh, one of my biggeste peeves to.... i don't get ppl like that...

2004-09-13 [Snowboarding Hobitz]: i no...they just want attention

2004-09-14 [Pale-Suzie]: heh, yeah... but the worst part is how they screw it up for ppl who are actually deppressed... -_-

2004-09-14 [Lioness123]: I just think that its funny how the people who dress like goths and act all dark and evil, are now the COOL people and acting gothic is now IN! Its like, the outsiders are now the in crowd and people don't dress in black to be an individual anymore like they used to. They do it now because its the cool thing to do!

2004-09-14 [Pale-Suzie]: heh... yeah, i know a couple of ppl who do that... i used to dress up like that, not so much because i wanted to be cool, more because i was different anyway, i might as well become REAL different... and then all of the sudden there was like... 20 other ppl dressing like me? that made me so different... in the end i got fed up with ppl only dressing in black to be cool and with no contact with reality... so i became 'normal' again... but it still ticks me of that i couldn't were stuff like that, cause ppl would then asume i was all like them... ugh... -_-

2004-09-14 [Lioness123]: LOL. I remember when the preppy people would whisper about the gothic kids and stare when they walked by in the highschool hallway.

2004-09-14 [Lioness123]: now THEY dress the same way!

2004-09-14 [ArchangelGabriel]: how can you suport this? Surly its like saying that black and white people can't marry?

2004-09-14 [Pale-Suzie]: huh? who support? a good deal of us don't support it... i thought you were mentioning what we were talking about, but it's the wiki in general you're talking about right? oh well, for what we were talking about, i agree... the preps in my school still don't dress like that... but the ones who do it do it more to look 'cool' then anything else...

2004-09-14 [ArchangelGabriel]: yea but your saying that people who swing the other way don't have the same rights as you, thats discrimanation, its inequality

2004-09-14 [Pale-Suzie]: i agree totally, i dont' agree with this wiki, but some of the ppl in here are real nice so... that's what i'm doing in here. :P anyway, i agree with you, and you're far from the first person to say that...

2004-09-14 [Snowboarding Hobitz]: yes, weird isn't it, non supporters hang out here...but yet were all friends...hummm, we are monstrosities arent we. We go around to homosexual supporters clubs and leave rude messages reading 'how dare you" "your wrong" "how can you be so close minded" and cusing at them....if you ask me, teh world is full of opinions...you don't like ours, so be it, dissagree all you want....we don't care, you can't change our point of views, all you can ever do is mock us, tell us were close minded and wrong, and create arguments...its not going to change a thing, but go ahead and do it anyways

2004-09-14 [Pale-Suzie]: i dunno if we're all friends, but a lot of us get along just fine... i like a good debate, and i especially liek this debate... but by now it feels rather pointless... i don't wanna fight about something, i know i'm not gonna change anyones opinion about. now i'm not saying i'm backing down, cause i still think it's interesting to discuss... but sometimes i just feel like slamming my head against a wall when someone tells me how WRONG this wiki is... well we know... we've already heard it... i agree... but couldn't we come up with something that HASN'T been said a thousand times? and even better, saying it nicely? i guess not... -_-

2004-09-14 [Snowboarding Hobitz]: yes, and please, rember who you are talking to, i don't appriciate it when you hang out here and call us wrong...i feel that its totally out of place, because as we all know, we all believe diffrent things...so please, be respectful...and i do agree with you in the fact that we arent' going to get anything solved arguing...so lets just drop this....

2004-09-15 [Lioness123]: amen to that

2004-09-15 [Young J.C.]: Yes, please stop arguing!

2004-09-15 [Snowboarding Hobitz]: right...so how is everyone tonight

2004-09-15 [Nona_da_rockstar]: good good...and yourself? HEY!!! your from COLORADO SBH!!!! I live there too

2004-09-15 [Snowboarding Hobitz]: yeah!!! cool! *laughs* I know you...geeze, just call me

2004-09-15 [Young J.C.]: Haha. Crazy nuts!

2004-09-15 [take me home and feed me]: hey do yall realize that the first banner they put are instead of our AND I HAD SOME JERK TELL ME THIS

2004-09-15 [Lioness123]: ??

2004-09-15 [Snowboarding Hobitz]: what was that Git r done?

2004-09-15 [ArchangelGabriel]: Sorry, i know your against same sex marrige but are you against gays or not?

2004-09-15 [Lioness123]: lobsang, are you talking to the whole room or one person inparticular?

2004-09-15 [ArchangelGabriel]: Over all view of this wiki. Are people ok with the idea of gays or not?

2004-09-15 [Lioness123]: I don't hate gays, but I seriously disagree with their lifestyle. I still treat them with the respect that every human being deserves though. Hate the sin, not the sinner.

2004-09-15 [ArchangelGabriel]: so your opposed to the idea that guys(girls) can be turned on by other guys(girls)? But not the guys(girls) themelves

2004-09-15 [Lioness123]: come again?

2004-09-15 [ArchangelGabriel]: you don't like the idea of gays but your ok with the gays them selves, is that what you meant?

2004-09-15 [Lioness123]: if you put it that way, yeah. Gays are people too

2004-09-15 [ArchangelGabriel]: So why are you against the idea? Its completly natral, examples have been found in every single species

2004-09-15 [Lioness123]: for many reasons. I fyou wanna know, I put the top 10 in top 10 reasons against gay marriage

2004-09-15 [Pale-Suzie]: nope, not every specie... just the inteligent once, but that is an even better point i think... animals don't start showing gay tendencies before they develop a brain with some function anyway... that means, gayness is a sign of an intelliginet lifeform... :P

2004-09-15 [Lioness123]: oh brother...

2004-09-15 [Pale-Suzie]: sounds a bit like what i said after reading the top ten reasons... ohla, that was.... interesting reading. o_o

2004-09-15 [ArchangelGabriel]: Its a valid point although i don't think it would hold up i court. Any way what would realy be diffrent if gays where alowed to marry? surly the world would be just the same? except with out the discrimination. Marrige is the offical version of love, it helps the way people live, if a gay dies his boyfriend wouldn't be able to lay any claims on whats left behind fr instance

2004-09-15 [Lioness123]: well, I expect that maybe someday a bill or something will be passed to permit gay marriage, but what then? Gay people will not be satisfied that the church doesn't recognize it, and then they'll start the fight ALL over again to make the church recognize the marriage.

2004-09-15 [Lioness123]: But that will never happen, at least in the roman catholic church.

2004-09-15 [ArchangelGabriel]: Religoin causes so many problems, why would a god make gays and then rsay their not alowed, why should inocent people have to suffer for the sexual orientation they're born with?

2004-09-15 [Lioness123]: thats another thing...whos to say that they were born with it or if it was a lifestyle they chose? I believe someday science will uncover that one

2004-09-15 [ArchangelGabriel]: If some one finds that they can't help being atracted to guys how is it their fault?

2004-09-15 [Lioness123]: if they believe its wrong, then they shouldn't act on their urges.

2004-09-15 [ArchangelGabriel]: you mean they should live a lie? liking woman is acting ona naurge as well.

2004-09-15 [Lioness123]: ok, I have heard that homosexuality MAY have something to do with the pituitary gland in the brain not functioning properly, thats the only way I could see someone being born gay. If thats the case, get medical help.

2004-09-15 [ArchangelGabriel]: but its like changing the way you think, your thoughts are private not just editable

2004-09-15 [Lioness123]: in any case, homosexuality is not normal. People were not meant to be gay. If that were, then there would be no people left on the planet.

2004-09-15 [Lioness123]: what do you mean by that? The pituitary gland controls alot of hormone levels and growth developement in the body. I've studied this alot.

2004-09-15 [HiddenFire]: Homosexuality is natural see <URL:http://songweaver.com/info/bonobos.html>. It shows that homosexuality does happen in nature and in a very close relative of ours.

2004-09-15 [HiddenFire]: Some scientists have discovered that many species use homosexuality as a form of population control. The larger the population the more homosexuality occurs. It eventually finds somewhat of an equillibrium and the population evens out. I think homosexuality might be likened to a foot fetish. People are sexually attracted to feet because of the close proximity of the parts of the brain associated with both the feet and the genitals. But is a foot fetish wrong? Sure it's against biology... but it's also because of biology. It's a naturally occuring deviation in human sexuality. If it where to be a genetic/developmental thing then that seems proof enough to me that it is perfectly natural.

2004-09-15 [HiddenFire]: if it where genetic I would liken it to other normal deviations of the brain such as intelligence, ADD/ADHD, and so on. The brain is a unique thing, no one brain is exactly alike. Some think that sexuality is a scale, you can be on one end (extreme heterosexual) or the other (extreme homosexual). But the extremes rarely exist, most people are nearer to the middle than they would like to admit.

2004-09-15 [HiddenFire]: in other words, just because their brains behave differently doesn't mean they need "correction."

2004-09-15 [ArchangelGabriel]: seeing things from diffrent sides is a very western idea. We all think that one side is right and the other wrong, but when you get down to it there is no good or bad, or right or wrong, only the islands of differnce we make ourselves and hand down to our children.

2004-09-15 [Lioness123]: it all depends on you own beliefs and point of view.

2004-09-15 [HiddenFire]: I agree with [ArchangelGabriel] who you think the "bad guys" are is totally dependant upon which side your on. Of course your side is allways right, otherwise how could you support it? I certainly couldn't argue my point effectively if I where to actually admit that i could be wrong. In my mind there is no way I'm wrong. I'd be glad if someone could show me, prove to me that I am wrong but I don't see that happening. I would certianly admit it if I where wrong... I just don't think I'm wrong. As I'm sure you all think you're right. It's just the way the mind works. @.@

2004-09-15 [Snowboarding Hobitz]: I believe people choose to be homosexuality...and they hide behind the excuse that "they can't help it", kind of like people with retardations hide behind that excuse in civil cases....as if its not their falt they killed someone, or what ever teh crime may be, thsi reminds me of a song by the Eagles...'get over it', its not our fault...so were a minority, and minoritis deserve special rights....I'm not nessacarealy saying that homosexuals WANT things like sped people...i'm just trying to say...*moving on* i'm sorry, i just toatlly added to the argument, i'll try to stay clear of it...i just had to voice my opinion

2004-09-15 [HiddenFire]: so you're saying that if someone has a frontal lobe injury that makes them unable to make rational decisions or control their impulses that they are simply "making excuses"? If someone burried a hammer in the front of your brain, and you somehow survived, how would you feel if you couldn't stop yourself when you attacked someone in the supermarket because they insulted you? That's hell on people with issues like that. Don't make light of it so readily.

2004-09-15 [HiddenFire]: and minorities do not diserve special rights. Everyone should be treated equally, reguardless of their race, religion, gender, color, appearance, sexuality, etc... Special treatment is a form of discrimination in it's own right.

2004-09-15 [Snowboarding Hobitz]: right...you totally took that the wrong way...this is why i don't discuse things in here....gourd, people

2004-09-15 [HiddenFire]: oh... sarcasm. Or some other use of an ironic writing form to express your dissliking of the situation by somehow making light of it... er... ok. @.@

2004-09-15 [Snowboarding Hobitz]: right...thats EXACTALLY what I ment...sometimes this wiki isn't worth my time, no matter how hard we try, people always bash us, take us the wronge way, mock us, call us wrong...prove how 'right' they are, and don't listin...i'm through arguing to all of you...come get me when this whole stupid thing is over

2004-09-15 [HiddenFire]: IT's allways frustrating. Like I said before: We are both incabable of seeing over the wall that we have both built between us (the two sides). Those against gay marraige are all ignorant redneck Klan members who attack people with the bible and beat gays to death for the fun of it. Those for gay marriage are all evil sodomites who are living in constant sin, diserve to be hanged, are nothing but lecherous, disease ridden, vermin who should be exterminated. (of course that is the stereotypical way that each side thinks the other side views them... and of course it's not true. @.@)

2004-09-15 [Combat Engineer]: can someone hook me up with the pw? via email

2004-09-16 [Lioness123]: my boyfriend told me that a gay guy in his college got a scholarship because he is gay. Now, what happened to gay people not wanting to be singled out?!

2004-09-16 [HiddenFire]: That really pisses me off. Just another scollarship that I can't get. howabout I just say I'm gay? Or pansexual? that way they can't aruge with me. I am tired of all these scollarships that are available to so many different people but not to me. I hate being a culturless white male. It pretty much leaves me shit out of luck when it comes to any kind of special treatment. I would love to see a scolarship that only went to white males. I'm sure that would go over great! @.@

2004-09-16 [Lioness123]: it's terrible hipicritical (sp)...they say that they don't want to be singled out, that they want the same benefits and rights as everyone else, and yet this guy got a scholarship...-just because he's gay. I should get a scholarship because I have blonde hair!

2004-09-16 [HiddenFire]: Well, there are scolarships for black people, jews, christians, hispanics, women, blah, blah, blah. Nothing for us indiviudally spiritual white males. I am actually what I call "White by default" I have such a diverse heritage that I have no heritage and am only white because I don't fit in any other category. That sucks more than being mostly German, or Jewish, or some other Caucasian ethnic group. I'm just Caucasian with no ethnicity. Sucks to be me. >.<

2004-09-16 [Lioness123]: yeah, I don't agree with the whole "getting money because of your race, gender, religion, etc." thing. I think that if you want a scholarship, you should EARN IT! I hate seeing people get things they didn't earn with hard work and determination.

2004-09-16 [HiddenFire]: actually if I could get a tribal card (even though I'm only 3/32 Native American) I would accept it if the government paid for all of my college. I'm too poor for such high moral fortitude. The fact is, I need the money. Part of me wants to see if I can join a tibe on my way to Phoenix! The rest of me wonders if I'll have to star in pornography to make enough money to afford it all. It's rather scary. @.@ If I was black or hispanic or gay I might not have this problem. @.@

2004-09-16 [Lioness123]: The way I see it, there's too many drains on the economy as it is. I've had a job since I was 14, I bought my own car, I pay for the gas, the insurance, and I hope to make enough money to move out soon.

2004-09-16 [HiddenFire]: I'm a lazy bum, but that's because I can't really find any good work in the stupid little town or even the surrounding towns. But honestly, if I where gay, I would take the money. Sure it pisses me off but not all of us can afford to be like that. Screw pride, the money is what counts. I'm thinking I might say I'm pansexual and see if I can't get away with it. I acutally am a bit of a pansexual... I just prefer women. *shrugs* LOL, but they don't have to know that. ~_^

2004-09-16 [Lioness123]: *shrugs* whatever floats your boat

2004-09-16 [HiddenFire]: and it certainly does "float my boat" ~_^ LOL

2004-09-16 [Snowboarding Hobitz]: ^^^ with top comments...this club at school is for asian people, or people of asian decent, and i'm Filipino, Native American, and Chinese/Japnese from my mother's side, but when i tried to join, they said i can't b/c i'm not "asian" enough...as in, it dosen't matter really where you came from, or what percentage i was, but the fact that i don't look it *i took after my dad's family, red hair, green eyes, light skin* and when their clubs would hold meetings ppl would talk about how we treat them so bad b/c of the color of their skin...HELLO, we never treat them bad, this is 2004, not 1804, i'm just agreeing with the whole "special needs" thing, truely, being a majority sucks

2004-09-16 [HiddenFire]: That's bullshit! Kids are so freaking stupid. How can they whine about discrimination when they are perpetuating it? If all the blacks assumed that the whites where against them then guess what? It's going to make it seem like we're against them! Perpetuating the discrimination whether it really exists or not. If I am treated on way because it is assumed that I discriminate against a certain group, that is discrimination. Assumptions are evil. Discrimination is evil. This world is seriously screwed up. @.@

2004-09-16 [Snowboarding Hobitz]: i agree with that...if they don't have the mentality that were always against them calling them "dirty mexicans" or "Niggers" *sorry if this offends you*, than it won't seem like it. I know that ppl out there are still prejudice, but, there are more people going for peace than discrimiation....if only the world woud open their eyes

2004-09-16 [Jewl]: Truly! OMG! Lol they have asian groups, afr./amer. groups, native american groups, and multi-culture groups. When i asked if I could join the multi-culture group, they said I couldn't. You know why? BECAUSE I'M WHITE!!! LOL! Right then and there I want to the adminisrtater of the school and demanded they include an AMERICAN club, and a club for EVERY other nationality that they didn't have in a club already. I got into a huge debate, and it eventually went to court, and now my school has no culture clubs that only allow certain people in. They have 3 now. The "American Club" For american citizens of any race, a "One Nationality"and a "Culture Club" For ANYONE with more than one nationality.

2004-09-16 [Jewl]: The one nationality club is for people with only one nationality. But, almost anyone can join, because technically American is a nationality.

2004-09-16 [HiddenFire]: Indeed. If they stoped thinking that the world was against them they would realize that it's acutally specailly taylored to them and the whites get the shit end of the stick because we're the only nationality that doesn't get special treatment in this country. I can't even join the Klan if I wanted to because of my mixed heritage (not that I want to mind you). Being "White by default" really does suck. And I would has done the exact same thing as you [Jewl]. Although I would have argued it in front of the club first. If they still didn't let me in, then I would go for the law suit. What a bunch of ignorant bastards, perpetuating discrimination. It's sad really.

2004-09-16 [Snowboarding Hobitz]: yes yes....people are so hipocritical

2004-09-16 [Jewl]: I know!!! My GOD, sheesh, I mean, black people wil NEVER see us as equals, until WE'RE THEIR slaves. They already think that just because their great-great-grandmother was a slave, they themselves have the right to treat all white people like shit. Well, hell, we both bleed, we both shit and fart and reproduce, and EVERYTHING ELSE HUMANS DO!

2004-09-17 [Lioness123]: LMAO

2004-09-17 [Leelo]: Hey

2004-09-17 [Lioness123]: wuz up

2004-09-17 [Leelo]: nothing much you?

2004-09-17 [Lioness123]: nothin...eating hersheys chocolate and drinking pepsi

2004-09-17 [Leelo]: I'm eating cotton candy ice-cream and drinking a cup of water

2004-09-17 [Snowboarding Hobitz]: i'm trying to wake up...why am i up *cries* i wanna go back to sleep....this sucks, i can't even controle when i'm awake or asleep

2004-09-17 [Lioness123]: lol, put your cotton candy in the water and you'll have kool-aid!

2004-09-17 [Leelo]: lol same here

2004-09-17 [Lioness123]: ooOOooo...ice-cream...missed that part :P

2004-09-17 [Leelo]: LMAO!!!!!

2004-09-17 [Lioness123]: Mmm...ice-cream sounds good right now

2004-09-17 [Leelo]: Yeah and I am eating some

2004-09-17 [Leelo]: lol

2004-09-19 [Snowboarding Hobitz]: ice cream...i had a milkshake yesterday...and a popsicle a little bit ago....does that count?

2004-09-19 [Lioness123]: I think so...have you guys ever tried astronaught ice-cream? Its gross!

2004-09-19 [Snowboarding Hobitz]: no...i thought it would be fun...why is it gross

2004-09-20 [Lioness123]: because its not cold, it doesn't tase like ice-cream and it doesn't even look like ice-cream

2004-09-20 [Shee A'beanne Alainn]: how can ice cream not be cold?

2004-09-20 [Young J.C.]: Ok, everyone in here is agaisnt gays completely right?

2004-09-20 [Lioness123]: against gay MARRIAGE

2004-09-20 [Young J.C.]: Just that?

2004-09-20 [Shee A'beanne Alainn]: We are not against the people...we are against the concept of them being married...and their life styles...I think....

2004-09-20 [Young J.C.]: The marriage thing is wrong, but why do you people hate it?

2004-09-20 [Shee A'beanne Alainn]: Hmmm hate is a strong word...I woudn;t say...I personly dissaprove of it.

2004-09-20 [Young J.C.]: Ok. I see now. But makes no sense though.

2004-09-20 [Lioness123]: Hmm...ok...I think that marriage should be reserved just for men and women, but I do believe that gay couples should be allowed some sort of "union" in the eyes of the government.

2004-09-20 [Young J.C.]: I don't like the idea of gay people getting married either, but what can people do about love?

2004-09-20 [Snowboarding Hobitz]: *listins*

2004-09-20 [ArchangelGabriel]: marriage isn't just a way of showing love, it can help in certain situations such as inheritance

2004-09-20 [The Scarlet Pumpernickle]: I think the whole gay pride thing is stupid. They say they want to be no different from everyone else and yet the hold huge parades just for gay people,if that's not descrimination I'd like to know what is

2004-09-20 [HiddenFire]: It is odd, now that you mention it. But don't specific ethnicities also have parades? Or parade-like happenings. I don't know why they do it. Honstely I don't particularly like pride either. People should learn to be more humble and your sexual preference is nothing to be proud of. It's a non-issue as far as I'm concerned. That would be like being proud of my hair color. Granted, I'm moderately proud about my curly hair... but not the fact that it's black. *shrugs*I suppose there is a difference between liking something about one's self and being proud of it. *shrugs*

2004-09-20 [Snowboarding Hobitz]: *shrug* *shrug*...*nudge nudge*

2004-09-20 [Lioness123]: I, from this point on, consider myself a European-American and therefor should be treated special like, getting a scholarship at college.